Catskills Egg Scripters getting bolder and bolder

On Catskills server, there was a specific, mountless, wraith form, scripter who was on all day by my account. He was on at 8am this morning. I consistently saw him recalling to three different sides of the same screen in Yew steadily throughout the day. He was still going at 11:30 pm when I logged out. I reported him to a GM as did other people I interacted with. Happy to provide more information on this specific individual.

To the devs, not policing this event and not taking action after so many complaints is essentially green lighting abuse. This will impact the economy within the game. This does impact active players from effectively participating in the event. This will introduce many times more event items than should have been earned. These items will not be spread evenly throughout the population and will instead be up on gold selling websites, used by gold sellers for multiboxing events, etc. The difference between this mattering and not is that those who would like to reasonably participate in the event cannot effectively do so.

I suggest the following corrective actions:
-Increase the drop rate of Fey items in dungeon Destard in some way (increase the % chance from normal mobs, guaranteed drops from paragons, etc.) 
-Stop EJ accounts from being able to interact with Curious Eggs.

The first will make it efficient for people to play the event. The second prevents afk to win abuse.

I have been playing games all day also.  Will be up a few more hours also.

I recall to the same spots also.  I think most of us do.

Like me, he was attended when the GM came to check.

Let me know when egg prices are real low so I can buy some. thanks

If you think someone is scripting PAGE A GM!

Do like others do, get ahead of them and take the eggs first.

Make them admit what they are doing in overhead chat.  If you need help on how to annoy someone to the breaking point, let me know.

Why use wraith form, isn't that slow? The eggs don't spawn same exact spot, need to run around including opening doors. Active players should be able to beat them.

Seth said:

Why use wraith form, isn't that slow? The eggs don't spawn same exact spot, need to run around including opening doors. Active players should be able to beat them.

Probably for the no fail recall, due to low level Magery.

Victim_Of_Siege said:

Seth said:

Why use wraith form, isn't that slow? The eggs don't spawn same exact spot, need to run around including opening doors. Active players should be able to beat them.

Probably for the no fail recall, due to low level Magery.

Wraith form allows you to cast recall without fail regardless of low magery? 

"yes"

Pawain said:
I recall to the same spots also.  I think most of us do.

Pawain, I do not have 3 different recall spots for 1 Yew farm spot or 1 Moonglow house. This guy did. 

Pawain said:

If you think someone is scripting PAGE A GM!

Do like others do, get ahead of them and take the eggs first.

Make them admit what they are doing in overhead chat.  If you need help on how to annoy someone to the breaking point, let me know.

I did. I do. It is unfair that someone can automate this process for 14 hours a day on an EJ account and reap the benefit. If it's fair game then why have an event, just give us each the event items and let me not waste my time.

I proposed an easy fix to this issue for the devs, make EJ accounts not able to interact with eggs. Then someone would at least need to put their real accounts in jeopardy when automating play.

Rom said:

Pawain said:

If you think someone is scripting PAGE A GM!

Do like others do, get ahead of them and take the eggs first.

Make them admit what they are doing in overhead chat.  If you need help on how to annoy someone to the breaking point, let me know.

I did. I do. It is unfair that someone can automate this process for 14 hours a day on an EJ account and reap the benefit. If it's fair game then why have an event, just give us each the event items and let me not waste my time.

I proposed an easy fix to this issue for the devs, make EJ accounts not able to interact with eggs. Then someone would at least need to put their real accounts in jeopardy when automating play.

I can't agree more here in terms of unfair.  These scripts are running on every single shard nonstop. Someone (likely a RMT seller) has these going on probably 4 PC's with 30 PC images.  It is non-stop. They only way to stop them is bag ball their recall spots.  They are getting probably 300-500 points per day.  They will sell these items for months to come when the event it over and the only way to get it is from a RMT scripter.  The UO dev team needs to put an ounce of thought into these events and what can and can't be easily scripted.  Most these eggs spawn in defined locations in guardzones.  Impossible to kill these scripters in Tram and even in Fel.  

I have no problem competing against human players (and I know who they are on my shard) but when 3 bots or so are going at the same time - there is very little for the honest player.  

To those that say 'can't you just go faster than the bot?'  well they can flip an atlas or recall book faster than I can and when more than one is going at different patterns (top to bottom, bottom to top) you can't get ahead - the best you can do is get one or two eggs between them recalling in.

SOmetimes its like O'hare airport with a scripter dropping in every 5-10 seconds. This is so simple to police if you really wanted to.  

I've just come to the conclusion scripting is OK.  They never seem to go away.  They are constantly at it.  Its disrespectful to those working in Destard trying to get an honest reward. 

@theo Fast turn in can be done by humans also:

https://forum.uo.com/discussion/10728/how-to-select-eggs-as-a-quest-item-in-an-ec-macro

Pawain said:

@ theo Fast turn in can be done by humans also:

https://forum.uo.com/discussion/10728/how-to-select-eggs-as-a-quest-item-in-an-ec-macro

Why are you so unwilling to accept there are scripters?

We have a wraith guy egg collector on our shard too wondered why he used that form.  Would not say for sure he is scripter.  He recalls around a lot but don’t think he is on 24/7.  He’s usually there and gone before I can talk to him.
Egg prices have not moved much on my shard.  They have not kept up with the price of ingots making ingots a much better deal if you are after a Destard dungeon reward.

I've noticed a few egg scripters on ATL (which isn't to say they aren't attended) by simply standing at the turn in guy. I see the same couple toons recall in (which for ATL they mark off screen as not to be blocked) and they run up to the same exact spot every single time and stop.

Just applying a little common sense will tell ya they are using a rail to get to a designated tile to run the quest... or they just have extreme OCD and need to park at the exact same tile every time they run on screen to accept the quest 

Pac has a suspected scripter in wraith form as well. 

Theo said:

Rom said:

Pawain said:

If you think someone is scripting PAGE A GM!

Do like others do, get ahead of them and take the eggs first.

Make them admit what they are doing in overhead chat.  If you need help on how to annoy someone to the breaking point, let me know.

I did. I do. It is unfair that someone can automate this process for 14 hours a day on an EJ account and reap the benefit. If it's fair game then why have an event, just give us each the event items and let me not waste my time.

I proposed an easy fix to this issue for the devs, make EJ accounts not able to interact with eggs. Then someone would at least need to put their real accounts in jeopardy when automating play.

I can't agree more here in terms of unfair.  These scripts are running on every single shard nonstop. Someone (likely a RMT seller) has these going on probably 4 PC's with 30 PC images.  It is non-stop. They only way to stop them is bag ball their recall spots.  They are getting probably 300-500 points per day.  They will sell these items for months to come when the event it over and the only way to get it is from a RMT scripter.  The UO dev team needs to put an ounce of thought into these events and what can and can't be easily scripted.  Most these eggs spawn in defined locations in guardzones.  Impossible to kill these scripters in Tram and even in Fel.  

I have no problem competing against human players (and I know who they are on my shard) but when 3 bots or so are going at the same time - there is very little for the honest player.  

To those that say 'can't you just go faster than the bot?'  well they can flip an atlas or recall book faster than I can and when more than one is going at different patterns (top to bottom, bottom to top) you can't get ahead - the best you can do is get one or two eggs between them recalling in.

SOmetimes its like O'hare airport with a scripter dropping in every 5-10 seconds. This is so simple to police if you really wanted to.  

I've just come to the conclusion scripting is OK.  They never seem to go away.  They are constantly at it.  Its disrespectful to those working in Destard trying to get an honest reward. 

The UO dev team needs to put an ounce of thought into these events and what can and can't be easily scripted. 

While I do agree that scripters should definitively be dealt with, I do not want to see this alternative "non-combat" way to gather points to be gone because of scripters....

I'd rather much prefer the Developers to get rid of these scripters without taking away from players non scripting this alternative "non-combat" way of getting points.

Yoshi said:

"too many eggs for me to collect on this bot"

Thanks for the leftovers by the way. 

I must have missed it. Where are all the hot spots to watch for the eggs/scripters?

The best spots for Eggs are Brit farms Fel/tram Skara Farms Fel/Tram. Yew Fel/Tram and the little islands all over tokuno.  as far as Scripters go, they are usually where the egss are . . .

Seth said:

Why use wraith form, isn't that slow? The eggs don't spawn same exact spot, need to run around including opening doors. Active players should be able to beat them.

This wraith moved faster than I have seen any do.
I wasn't lagging and I was riding an ethereal and it went around me like I was on foot.
And I wasn't lagging either

Rom said:

On Catskills server, there was a specific, mountless, wraith form, scripter who was on all day by my account. He was on at 8am this morning. I consistently saw him recalling to three different sides of the same screen in Yew steadily throughout the day. He was still going at 11:30 pm when I logged out. I reported him to a GM as did other people I interacted with. Happy to provide more information on this specific individual.

To the devs, not policing this event and not taking action after so many complaints is essentially green lighting abuse. This will impact the economy within the game. This does impact active players from effectively participating in the event. This will introduce many times more event items than should have been earned. These items will not be spread evenly throughout the population and will instead be up on gold selling websites, used by gold sellers for multiboxing events, etc. The difference between this mattering and not is that those who would like to reasonably participate in the event cannot effectively do so.

I suggest the following corrective actions:
-Increase the drop rate of Fey items in dungeon Destard in some way (increase the % chance from normal mobs, guaranteed drops from paragons, etc.) 
-Stop EJ accounts from being able to interact with Curious Eggs.

The first will make it efficient for people to play the event. The second prevents afk to win abuse.

You are a Legendary Assumer. You throw out every "bad actor" scenario in the hope that someone with the ability to make change reads it and says "oh no we must stop all these gold selling websites." Either way as long as the person is attended whats your problem? Is it because you cant gather as efficiently as they do? Or is it because you dont have the assumed script they do? And how do you know how many reward items are allowed to be collected during an event? I would be willing to go out on a limb and say you were most likely someone that was taking advantage of the absurd drop rate the first few days. If so, was that not exploiting a bug? My distain for the Cats shard may be leaking into my objectiveness. 

McDougle said:

Pawain said:

@ theo Fast turn in can be done by humans also:

https://forum.uo.com/discussion/10728/how-to-select-eggs-as-a-quest-item-in-an-ec-macro

Why are you so unwilling to accept there are scripters?

Compared to what I use, CC with nothing else, most of you are scripting legally as these players are or they would not be able to hold a conversation with a GM.

I understand the power of a gamer and what they can do.

The same name toon as Yoshi killed is on LS.  I see them turn in eggs in Tram, but they are not speedy about it.

Cinderella said:

Seth said:

Why use wraith form, isn't that slow? The eggs don't spawn same exact spot, need to run around including opening doors. Active players should be able to beat them.

This wraith moved faster than I have seen any do.
I wasn't lagging and I was riding an ethereal and it went around me like I was on foot.
And I wasn't lagging either

Maybe he is using some accelerator, speed hacking software.

GM!

I normally don't post on stuff like this because well.. I feel its pointless. But I'm bored so why not!

The problem goes wayyyyy beyond scripting some eggs honestly. The mismanagement of this game over the past several years is honestly the real problem. Once you open the doors to modifiable clients, and allow these clients to connect to the server, its a wrap at that point. If UO was restricted to the good old classic client, and all other clients, even the EC were removed, we wouldn't have half of the problems we do now.

It fairly frustrating in the PvP world to fight people who are running the new fad client, that has built in scripts for every pvp related action imaginable. I always had a lot of pride in the fact that I was a "legit" pvper. But it didn't and still doesn't matter. In the pvp world I am just old school, or outdated, or too stupid to modify my EC client to compete. Modded clients and scripts is the new norm, and it has gone on far too long for the devs to do a damn thing about it without banning half the games already dwindling population. 

And all that TLDR leads to the current problem... The new clients make learning the code and developing scripts super simple, and within days someone wrote a script that people are using to collect eggs... a script that would not work in the good ol classic UO or EC.  

So that leads me to ask.. why care? why post novels about scripting and boo hoo all day about it when scripting exists in all aspects of this game, and has gone on far too long to extinguish? Just do what everyone else is doing, learn the "new" clients and play UO plug and push play. But oh.. you wanna be legit.... like me. lol have fun with that, and get use to being completely ignored. They will just continue to try and make events "lol non scriptable" Which makes it 20 times more difficult for the "legit" players. Which will lead to the dwindling of the "legit" players who will either quit or jump on the bandwagon. Its a circle, a cycle that will finally might be the final nail in the coffin. 

GTO said:

Rom said:

On Catskills server, there was a specific, mountless, wraith form, scripter who was on all day by my account. He was on at 8am this morning. I consistently saw him recalling to three different sides of the same screen in Yew steadily throughout the day. He was still going at 11:30 pm when I logged out. I reported him to a GM as did other people I interacted with. Happy to provide more information on this specific individual.

To the devs, not policing this event and not taking action after so many complaints is essentially green lighting abuse. This will impact the economy within the game. This does impact active players from effectively participating in the event. This will introduce many times more event items than should have been earned. These items will not be spread evenly throughout the population and will instead be up on gold selling websites, used by gold sellers for multiboxing events, etc. The difference between this mattering and not is that those who would like to reasonably participate in the event cannot effectively do so.

I suggest the following corrective actions:
-Increase the drop rate of Fey items in dungeon Destard in some way (increase the % chance from normal mobs, guaranteed drops from paragons, etc.) 
-Stop EJ accounts from being able to interact with Curious Eggs.

The first will make it efficient for people to play the event. The second prevents afk to win abuse.

You are a Legendary Assumer. You throw out every "bad actor" scenario in the hope that someone with the ability to make change reads it and says "oh no we must stop all these gold selling websites." Either way as long as the person is attended whats your problem? Is it because you cant gather as efficiently as they do? Or is it because you dont have the assumed script they do? And how do you know how many reward items are allowed to be collected during an event? I would be willing to go out on a limb and say you were most likely someone that was taking advantage of the absurd drop rate the first few days. If so, was that not exploiting a bug? My distain for the Cats shard may be leaking into my objectiveness. 

"I would be willing to go out on a limb and say you were most likely someone that was taking advantage..." You sir are the Legendary assumer in this scenario. I returned to the game around the time the event began after an 11 year hiatus and did not know about the event until after several weeks into it. So you could not be more wrong in this regard. Will you address the substance of my query now?

What I am is the canary in the coal mine. I am the most receptive audience to increasing UO's population and it is not making a good impression at all. To return to rampant exploiting, an event that is mostly unplayable as intended and zero feedback or accountability does not speak well to the current state of affairs. I have little interest in playing against bots that run for 14 hours a day and then try to sell me rewards for real life money.

Giggles said:

I normally don't post on stuff like this because well.. I feel its pointless. But I'm bored so why not!

The problem goes wayyyyy beyond scripting some eggs honestly. The mismanagement of this game over the past several years is honestly the real problem. Once you open the doors to modifiable clients, and allow these clients to connect to the server, its a wrap at that point. If UO was restricted to the good old classic client, and all other clients, even the EC were removed, we wouldn't have half of the problems we do now.

It fairly frustrating in the PvP world to fight people who are running the new fad client, that has built in scripts for every pvp related action imaginable. I always had a lot of pride in the fact that I was a "legit" pvper. But it didn't and still doesn't matter. In the pvp world I am just old school, or outdated, or too stupid to modify my EC client to compete. Modded clients and scripts is the new norm, and it has gone on far too long for the devs to do a damn thing about it without banning half the games already dwindling population. 

And all that TLDR leads to the current problem... The new clients make learning the code and developing scripts super simple, and within days someone wrote a script that people are using to collect eggs... a script that would not work in the good ol classic UO or EC.  

So that leads me to ask.. why care? why post novels about scripting and boo hoo all day about it when scripting exists in all aspects of this game, and has gone on far too long to extinguish? Just do what everyone else is doing, learn the "new" clients and play UO plug and push play. But oh.. you wanna be legit.... like me. lol have fun with that, and get use to being completely ignored. They will just continue to try and make events "lol non scriptable" Which makes it 20 times more difficult for the "legit" players. Which will lead to the dwindling of the "legit" players who will either quit or jump on the bandwagon. Its a circle, a cycle that will finally might be the final nail in the coffin. 

 ❤️ 

We've got some good post in this thread we also have fan kids saying scripters what scripers combine that with accusatory comments and the thread crumbles into another locked thread let's stay focused and ask for acknowledgement and accountability..

Rom said: 

"I would be willing to go out on a limb and say you were most likely someone that was taking advantage..." You sir are the Legendary assumer in this scenario. I returned to the game around the time the event began after an 11 year hiatus and did not know about the event until after several weeks into it. So you could not be more wrong in this regard. Will you address the substance of my query now?

What I am is the canary in the coal mine. I am the most receptive audience to increasing UO's population and it is not making a good impression at all. To return to rampant exploiting, an event that is mostly unplayable as intended and zero feedback or accountability does not speak well to the current state of affairs. I have little interest in playing against bots that run for 14 hours a day and then try to sell me rewards for real life money.

And to add to my post above yours... If you think the people scripting this event are gold selling websites, you are mistaken. 96% of them are just normal players who are unwilling to devote a week of gameplay and lots of death to get that quiver they really want.

When you make events like this... events that rely on a large amount of people working together to achieve "victory", every shard other than Atlantic simply cannot handle it. Not enough people online and working it at the same time, which leads to Archer Joe running around tagging the normal monsters with a large train of paragons running behind him, for like a hour or two until there's just too many paragons, and he got maybe 6 drops from all that effort. You can get 6 drops in about 20 minutes or less turning in eggs. You do the math. So yeah... its not gold sellers, its normal people who found a way to participate in the event which is a more reasonable time commitment for the same reward.

But posts like yours just makes the devs freak out and obsess over all the evil doing scripters ruining their content, instead of maybe admitting that their content is a tad too difficult for the large majority of their servers, and the rewards is not as plentiful as it should be for the effort required. But what am I saying? Crazy talk right?
 

Many Computer gamers are smart, many know how to program.  This has been going on since games were on floppy disks.  It takes a smarter person to combat it.

Giggles said:

Rom said: 

"I would be willing to go out on a limb and say you were most likely someone that was taking advantage..." You sir are the Legendary assumer in this scenario. I returned to the game around the time the event began after an 11 year hiatus and did not know about the event until after several weeks into it. So you could not be more wrong in this regard. Will you address the substance of my query now?

What I am is the canary in the coal mine. I am the most receptive audience to increasing UO's population and it is not making a good impression at all. To return to rampant exploiting, an event that is mostly unplayable as intended and zero feedback or accountability does not speak well to the current state of affairs. I have little interest in playing against bots that run for 14 hours a day and then try to sell me rewards for real life money.

And to add to my post above yours... If you think the people scripting this event are gold selling websites, you are mistaken. 96% of them are just normal players who are unwilling to devote a week of gameplay and lots of death to get that quiver they really want.

When you make events like this... events that rely on a large amount of people working together to achieve "victory", every shard other than Atlantic simply cannot handle it. Not enough people online and working it at the same time, which leads to Archer Joe running around tagging the normal monsters with a large train of paragons running behind him, for like a hour or two until there's just too many paragons, and he got maybe 6 drops from all that effort. You can get 6 drops in about 20 minutes or less turning in eggs. You do the math. So yeah... its not gold sellers, its normal people who found a way to participate in the event which is a more reasonable time commitment for the same reward.

But posts like yours just makes the devs freak out and obsess over all the evil doing scripters ruining their content, instead of maybe admitting that their content is a tad too difficult for the large majority of their servers, and the rewards is not as plentiful as it should be for the effort required. But what am I saying? Crazy talk right?
 

I stand by my feedback. Scripting an activity you're unwilling to take place in should be tolerated? I went out and manually collected eggs for several days and am forced to compete against bots... How is that in any way fair? How do you defend this to new or returning players?

See I've said before i just want to fish and pirate and if you'd just add the new rewards to the black market I'd never step on land people are shoehorned into doing things.  RMT sellers and scripters would be out of business if you sold everything they do on uo store and maybe they if uo had cash flow they'd give the developers resources. 

Rom said:

I stand by my feedback. Scripting an activity you're unwilling to take place in should be tolerated? I went out and manually collected eggs for several days and am forced to compete against bots... How is that in any way fair? How do you defend this to new or returning players?

Its not my job or your job to defend this.. Its the Devs. I was crying about people scripting "insert practically any activity you can think of" for years, and there was never a reasonable response.

Do you know why this event is so difficult? Do you know why the paragons reveal anyone hidden? Do you know why its not possible to solo it? Do you know why the mods teleport to you randomly? I'll give you one guess.... SCRIPTERS!! This event embodies every single anti scripting thing they could possible think of to prevent people from script doing it, or doing it alone. 

You couldn't possibly guess how many times throughout the years I have reached out to the devs with ideas or questions... I asked why these new clients were being allowed to connect to the official servers. I got silence as a response.
I asked why people were allowed to script loot idocs.. I got silence as a response.

Don't you see? they don't answer us.. they don't do a thing about the actual scripting... Look what they did to idocs, to these events, all of the horrible game changes in the past 6 years have just been because they are trying to stop people from scripting them, instead of dealing with the core problem. Them changing content to prevent scripting is just making it harder and harder on "legit" people to compete.

All of the posts on this forum crying about the eggs turnin, which otherwise is a pretty neat idea will lead to only one outcome..... Next event won't have anything like it for those pesky scripters to exploit. Even though several legit player are enjoying this alternative. it won't matter, because its too easy to script! delete it! Yeah.. that's logical alright, but I bet you money that's exactly what they will do about it.  

Hell I even joined the VvV focus group, excited to help make this new content. Everything was going great until one day one of the devs wandered into the hot forums and discovered that the pvpers there were "horrible toxic people" and all of his involvement in helping the PvP community suddenly stopped..

So please, continue to complain. You will get silence as your reward, and you will notice the next events to be even less fun and more difficult. 

This is the worst state UO has ever been in by a long shot. It’s clear we need new leadership, but I don’t think Broadsword cares. I just think they want to milk the last little bit out of its loyal fan base. If you’ve ever read the Reddit posts inside of Mesanna’s leadership you’d realize she has no true policy on holding scripters accountable. 

My new golden rule... if you enjoy something, anything in this game at its core design... Don't complaint about the scripters doing it. All you will end up with is changed and more difficult content.

 I still kick myself for complaining so much about people scripting idocs. What we have now is not fun, not engaging, and guess what? Scripters still win at them with their 15 account pathfinding and hitting barrels. And on that note, I'm gonna go back to lurking for another 6 months. See ya forums!

I thought its the classic client that is easy to build 3rd party scripts for bots. Have not seen any for EC bot Lua scripts.

They should just make the eggs spawn in truly random locations and not fixed areas. I feel like that would help. 

dvvid said:

They should just make the eggs spawn in truly random locations and not fixed areas. I feel like that would help. 

how would that help you or any other normal player get more eggs, pray tell?

“Some of the bots now are reprogrammed to not leave the guard zone, can no longer do anything about those bots”

Why is there some players who use scripts, Multi-tasking and all that ?

Because, at least is my opinion, they can benefit from that and, sometimes, not really only in the game but, also, outside of it with RMTs.

Sure, there is PvP players who, thanking to scripts and multi-tasking through the use of unauthorized Third Party utilities, have a clear advantage and, as a result, make PvP unplayable for those players not wanting to use cheats.... but, since this practise has not been eradicated from Ultima Online, that is the way it is and there is not much that we can do about it other then stay away from PvP for all of those players who do not want to use cheats and hacks....

Indeed UO suffers and looses players because of this status of things but what can players do ?

But for PvE gameplay ?

Clearly, at least to my opinion, here, something could be done....

To my opinion, one of the reasons prompting some players to script, perhaps AFK using unauthoriized third Party utilities, might be to get high end items that are very much time consuming to get, because of the game and mechanics Design, to then sell them for real money.

Because of how much time intensive these items are to be obtained in the game, this difficulty creates "motivation".....

And if they can be sold for real money, I need to imagine, that is perhaps because of how much time intensive they have been made to be obtained in the game..... "motivation" is created out of a given game Design....

Some people might think that they are better off to use cash to buy them rather then spend an unreasonable amount of time in the game to try get them...

THIS, to my opinion, is the real issue.

The TIME it takes for a player to get a given high end item in the game which, in turn, prompts some players to go as far as to use scripts, sometimes AFK, through Third Party unauthorized utilities, with a minimal involvement of their time to be invested in the game in order to get those items.....

The solution ?

The number 1 solution to finally deal with this and make all of this usage of scripts and cheat pointless, would be to MODIFY the Design of the game by making the chance for players to get these high end items WAY more likely and possible through regular, non-scripted gameplay....

If, to get a given high end item a player would need to spend, say, an hour or so and not days, weeks or months of trying, players would have no reason whatsoever to use scripts, hacks or buy those items with real money....

It is the artificial rarity of these items, to my opinion, created by the Design of the game, that motivates some players to want to use scripts and what not to get these items.

That is at least how I see it.

@Giggles - You make some very solid points. I'm similar to you in that I used to PvP (I think I was pretty good over a decade+ ago) and slowly faded away because of things like speed hacking / automated scripts. You are 100% right in that legit players have 2 choices; either jump on the bandwagon ("working smarter") or stay legit (unfortunately "working harder" to keep up). 

I think you also hit the nail on the head that many of the changes that have been made have been an attempt by the Dev team to stop scripting but as a result it's made things just more tedious for the legit player while only delaying the smart scripter a few days before figuring out how to beat it. 

I don't think scripting is going anywhere, especially after it seems like they don't action them anyway unless they are unattended but I do think that the Devs could allow the players to somewhat police themselves. What do I mean by that? I'm sure it will be unpopular but open up more events in Fel to PvP (ie make gathering eggs out of town in Fel more rewarding). This opens up things to more griefing tactics like blocking/luring/etc so that scripters will really need to pay attention rather than have something running in the background. 

@PlayerSkillFTW - That GM basically confirmed what I've thought for years which is basically that you just need to answer them to avoid action. What I thought was interesting though is that when we see an account action list in the newsletter, we see "multi-boxing" which seems like wouldn't be actionable given what the GM said (as long as the person can respond on each account). Makes me wonder if they are only actioning the overly egregious perpetrators or if they are classifying some the unattended people (ie unattended macroing on more than 1 account) as "multibox". 

If we accept the fact that scripting isnt going away; the ultimate fix for this scenario, and Im only talking THIS specific scripting issue, is to properly balance the main dungeons difficulty level and drop rate.  

Archangel said:

dvvid said:

They should just make the eggs spawn in truly random locations and not fixed areas. I feel like that would help. 

how would that help you or any other normal player get more eggs, pray tell?

I’m thinking that the scripting would possibly be less effective since there wouldn’t exactly be specific areas to get the eggs. Those collecting eggs would have to run around and find them like the start of the event, before it was realized that the eggs were spawning in specific areas. I’d imagine less scripters getting them would mean more actual players would. 

Giggles said:

Rom said: 

. I have little interest in playing against bots that run for 14 hours a day and then try to sell me rewards for real life money.

And to add to my post above yours... If you think the people scripting this event are gold selling websites, you are mistaken. 96% of them are just normal players who are unwilling to devote a week of gameplay and lots of death to get that quiver they really want.


 

What makes me believe it is gold selling websites is the fact that they advertise said rewards for real life $$ ($14 for a bird cage which is lunacy) on EVERY shard.   Forget the big ones - even the little trafficked shards with like 10 players.  If you go there - scripts are running 24/7.    

McDougle said:

See I've said before i just want to fish and pirate and if you'd just add the new rewards to the black market I'd never step on land people are shoehorned into doing things.  RMT sellers and scripters would be out of business if you sold everything they do on uo store and maybe they if uo had cash flow they'd give the developers resources. 

Completely agree here.  Every FEY reward should be sold in the UO store indefinately at 1 soverign per point.  If you play the event when its active you can get the reward. If you come back or join the game later - you can still buy it from UO.  Not from some cheating 3rd party website running scripts all day. If this were the case they would need to sell the item insanely cheap to beat the UO store which would make their time not worth it.  The money flows to UO and no one is hurt. You can either enjoy the event and earn the reward or pay a little extra $$ to UO and get the same reward.  I'm totally fine with it.  

What I'm not fine with is the event ruined for the honest player with 3rd parties making money off the game and UO doing nothing about it.  

dvvid said:

Archangel said:

dvvid said:

They should just make the eggs spawn in truly random locations and not fixed areas. I feel like that would help. 

how would that help you or any other normal player get more eggs, pray tell?

I’m thinking that the scripting would possibly be less effective since there wouldn’t exactly be specific areas to get the eggs. Those collecting eggs would have to run around and find them like the start of the event, before it was realized that the eggs were spawning in specific areas. I’d imagine less scripters getting them would mean more actual players would. 

LOL  That worked so well for mining and wood gathering.

JenniferMarie said:

People script in every video game ... just saying. [[It's not strictly an UO problem]]

Most other games take steps to curb scripting or make it nonprofitable.

And no ...

Giggles said:

Which will lead to the dwindling of the "legit" players who will either quit or jump on the bandwagon.

... these are not the only two options for "legit" players. The people I play with, quite a few others on my home shard, and myself have never "jumped on the bandwagon" of scripting and we're all still playing.

I would venture to say that scripting and/or using third party programs/clients has never been an enforceable action because EA/Origin or Broadsword were concerned taking action would result in a massive drop off in subscriptions - leading to a precipitous drop in revenue and putting the game in jeopardy.

The solution to that is the suggestion of micro transactions in the UO store.

I don't agree that all event rewards should be offered up in the UO store, but quite a few of them should be - as well as gold. Recycling event rewards every so often would also be a great way to keep the "economy" of UO reasonable.

There are a lot of solutions, but the dev team is small and working with limited manpower and resources.

There are a lot of solutions, but the dev team is small and working with limited manpower and resources.

As I tried to explain here, https://forum.uo.com/discussion/comment/77033/#Comment_77033 , I am of the opinion that, also a small dev team, could address the core reasons that motivate some players to script and use Third Party unauthorized utilities....

What core reasons I am talking about ?

The fact that, the current Design, makes it way too much time consuming to get high end items....

And as it is well known, time is the most expensive commodity there is....

Of course that there is players who do not want to spend absurd time to get high end items and either resort to scripting, AFK or not, or might decide to buy these in game items for real money from other players who, guess what... might have used scripting and AFK scripting to get them....

So, making BY DESIGN these items more readily available in the game, with much less time spent in game from players, would make it pointless for players to want to script, AFK or not, to get them, because just getting them in the game with regular gameplay and reasonable time hs been made more tolerable.

That is at least the way I see it.

popps said:

JenniferMarie said:

People script in every video game ... just saying. [[It's not strictly an UO problem]]

Most other games take steps to curb scripting or make it nonprofitable.

And no ...

Giggles said:

Which will lead to the dwindling of the "legit" players who will either quit or jump on the bandwagon.

... these are not the only two options for "legit" players. The people I play with, quite a few others on my home shard, and myself have never "jumped on the bandwagon" of scripting and we're all still playing.

I would venture to say that scripting and/or using third party programs/clients has never been an enforceable action because EA/Origin or Broadsword were concerned taking action would result in a massive drop off in subscriptions - leading to a precipitous drop in revenue and putting the game in jeopardy.

The solution to that is the suggestion of micro transactions in the UO store.

I don't agree that all event rewards should be offered up in the UO store, but quite a few of them should be - as well as gold. Recycling event rewards every so often would also be a great way to keep the "economy" of UO reasonable.

There are a lot of solutions, but the dev team is small and working with limited manpower and resources.

There are a lot of solutions, but the dev team is small and working with limited manpower and resources.

As I tried to explain here, https://forum.uo.com/discussion/comment/77033/#Comment_77033 , I am of the opinion that, also a small dev team, could address the core reasons that motivate some players to script and use Third Party unauthorized utilities....

What core reasons I am talking about ?

The fact that, the current Design, makes it way too much time consuming to get high end items....

And as it is well known, time is the most expensive commodity there is....

Of course that there is players who do not want to spend absurd time to get high end items and either resort to scripting, AFK or not, or might decide to buy these in game items for real money from other players who, guess what... might have used scripting and AFK scripting to get them....

So, making BY DESIGN these items more readily available in the game, with much less time spent in game from players, would make it pointless for players to want to script, AFK or not, to get them, because just getting them in the game with regular gameplay and reasonable time hs been made more tolerable.

That is at least the way I see it.

Even with the broken dungeon and scripting it's still possible to get all the drops you want is it enjoyable no but possible yes

popps said:

So, making BY DESIGN these items more readily available in the game, with much less time spent in game from players, would make it pointless for players to want to script, AFK or not, to get them, because just getting them in the game with regular gameplay and reasonable time hs been made more tolerable.

You're just a persnickety personality, aren't you? What part of my answer - where I suggested micro transactions in the UO store with sovereigns - was against making things more readily available?

The egg scripters create a challenge to getting the eggs.  Which is a good thing.  The usual two scripters I compete against have not been around on Pac for a few days. This is allowing me to get 30 to 40 eggs per run through of spawn spots.  It is becoming a little bit boring because it is now too easy to get eggs. I was PK'd the other day and they took all my eggs.  I did not care because I would only need to do another round of spawn spots to make up for the loss.  I was more upset that they took my small piece of black rock.

JenniferMarie said:

popps said:

So, making BY DESIGN these items more readily available in the game, with much less time spent in game from players, would make it pointless for players to want to script, AFK or not, to get them, because just getting them in the game with regular gameplay and reasonable time hs been made more tolerable.

You're just a persnickety personality, aren't you? What part of my answer - where I suggested micro transactions in the UO store with sovereigns - was against making things more readily available?

Perhaps because, in a very old game that cost a monthly subscription to be played when newer games are free to play, to have "too much" stuff available at the UO Store costing real money, could further loose subscribers to the game ?

Making instead, items more readily available IN the game, at a much more reasonable time expenditure in the game, and at no real money cost, could be, to my opinion, more beneficial to the game and, take away to those using scripts, the actual "motifs" to use scripts....

At least, that is how I see it.

Well the way I see being able to buy anything that the RMT sellers sell is a win win i can fish and pirate and the sellers would be out of business you can do your thing i can do mine

dvvid said:

Archangel said:

dvvid said:

They should just make the eggs spawn in truly random locations and not fixed areas. I feel like that would help. 

how would that help you or any other normal player get more eggs, pray tell?

I’m thinking that the scripting would possibly be less effective since there wouldn’t exactly be specific areas to get the eggs. Those collecting eggs would have to run around and find them like the start of the event, before it was realized that the eggs were spawning in specific areas. I’d imagine less scripters getting them would mean more actual players would. 

Well, if you´re not one collecting eggs, please don´t suggest how it could be bettered. I collect them, and I´ve never encountered scripters. I go to where they spawn and pick 'em and it works as intended.  Heck , maybe some ppl think I'm a bot, lol,

I wouldn't even believe possible a bot or any script could react to the many variables involved with picking eggs, Should I go arround opening stable gate, oh, better to teleport through fence, around the house, oh wait one just spawned after I clicked the rune destination, rune baack, rune out again, oh, now eggs are nowhere to be seen, lets give a tour through a +1screen radius, oh found 'em, next place empty, next place only 1 instead of 2 , go to next place but remember to return in 30 seconds, many spawns dried out, been too fast, where to next, site 14 of book 1 or yea,  site 4 of book 3, bingo, oh another player emptied this area, while they finish here I'll get to next area before them, time to circle all new haven island...

and so on and so forth.. and it works.. much to others chagrin and envy, I still can fill a bag in about 25 minutes.. and after an hour and 2 full bags I leave, so others can have their go (and cuz by then I'm dizzy and half zombied out)

no bloody script could ever account for so many unforeseeable variables! 

so please, don't give solutions you don't seem to need unless you are also picking eggs.

Domo arigato mr roboto

McDougle said:

Domo arigato mr roboto

do itashimashite McDoug san!

Great blast from the past btw!  

Lord_Frodo said:

dvvid said:

Archangel said:

dvvid said:

They should just make the eggs spawn in truly random locations and not fixed areas. I feel like that would help. 

how would that help you or any other normal player get more eggs, pray tell?

I’m thinking that the scripting would possibly be less effective since there wouldn’t exactly be specific areas to get the eggs. Those collecting eggs would have to run around and find them like the start of the event, before it was realized that the eggs were spawning in specific areas. I’d imagine less scripters getting them would mean more actual players would. 

LOL  That worked so well for mining and wood gathering.

Randomizing the ore and wood didn't kill scripting, but it made scripting less efficient, wouldn't you say?  I'm not talking about a way to completely eliminate scripting, just making it less worthwhile.

Archangel said:

dvvid said:

Archangel said:

dvvid said:

They should just make the eggs spawn in truly random locations and not fixed areas. I feel like that would help. 

how would that help you or any other normal player get more eggs, pray tell?

I’m thinking that the scripting would possibly be less effective since there wouldn’t exactly be specific areas to get the eggs. Those collecting eggs would have to run around and find them like the start of the event, before it was realized that the eggs were spawning in specific areas. I’d imagine less scripters getting them would mean more actual players would. 

Well, if you´re not one collecting eggs, please don´t suggest how it could be bettered. I collect them, and I´ve never encountered scripters. I go to where they spawn and pick 'em and it works as intended.  Heck , maybe some ppl think I'm a bot, lol,

I wouldn't even believe possible a bot or any script could react to the many variables involved with picking eggs, Should I go arround opening stable gate, oh, better to teleport through fence, around the house, oh wait one just spawned after I clicked the rune destination, rune baack, rune out again, oh, now eggs are nowhere to be seen, lets give a tour through a +1screen radius, oh found 'em, next place empty, next place only 1 instead of 2 , go to next place but remember to return in 30 seconds, many spawns dried out, been too fast, where to next, site 14 of book 1 or yea,  site 4 of book 3, bingo, oh another player emptied this area, while they finish here I'll get to next area before them, time to circle all new haven island...

and so on and so forth.. and it works.. much to others chagrin and envy, I still can fill a bag in about 25 minutes.. and after an hour and 2 full bags I leave, so others can have their go (and cuz by then I'm dizzy and half zombied out)

no bloody script could ever account for so many unforeseeable variables! 

so please, don't give solutions you don't seem to need unless you are also picking eggs.

I was collecting eggs before the last dungeon fix on ATL.  I now go in there because it is more fun.  

I'm amazed you haven't seen scripting.  Maybe you didn't realize, is also possible.  But do you really think everyone mentioning it is making stuff up?  

You would be impressed, as I was, what the scripts can do.  I've read on here and seen what people have said in Discord and finally decided to see for myself.  I went to the Yew sheep area on ATL and stood in the middle of the sheep.  No eggs, but the same people kept recalling in and out.  Nothing suspicious about that on the surface, so I was not convinced.

After waiting for an egg to spawn, which none did, I decided to test it myself.  I got an egg from my bank and went back to the spot.  Waited there for a minute or 2....saw the same people recalling in and out.  I then placed the egg next to me on the ground.  One of the characters recalled in and immediately started running to the egg, opening the stable doors no problem.  I picked up the egg as they were running and they ran to the exact spot where it was, stopped, then recalled out.

I put the egg back on the ground, another person recalled in, and started running to the egg immediately once again.  I picked up the egg and this character actually stopped the moment I picked the egg up.

Not entirely convinced this was scripted, I stuck around and did this several more times, moving to different areas, and the same exact thing happened with both of these 2 characters.  One would run all the way to the spot, even though it was obvious the egg was not there.  The other one stopping the exact moment I picked it up.  Neither of them said anything to me.  You'd think they would have something to say to me after I did this about 6 times to both of them.  I perceived this as 2 different scripts, one was better than the other.  It isn't 100% definitive proof, but seeing that in action was absolutely suspicious.

I recorded a video of some of this, but I don't even know if I care enough to do anything with the video.  I did report them though because of their actions being highly suspicious of unattended scripting. 

Anyway, my idea of randomizing the spots was merely and idea, not a stated solution.  I don't claim to know how to fix UO's problems.  I don't know why you seem to take personal offense.  Its just a thought.  I'm glad you haven't been affected negatively by the scripting.

dvvid said:

Lord_Frodo said:

dvvid said:

Archangel said:

dvvid said:

They should just make the eggs spawn in truly random locations and not fixed areas. I feel like that would help. 

how would that help you or any other normal player get more eggs, pray tell?

I’m thinking that the scripting would possibly be less effective since there wouldn’t exactly be specific areas to get the eggs. Those collecting eggs would have to run around and find them like the start of the event, before it was realized that the eggs were spawning in specific areas. I’d imagine less scripters getting them would mean more actual players would. 

LOL  That worked so well for mining and wood gathering.

Randomizing the ore and wood didn't kill scripting, but it made scripting less efficient, wouldn't you say?  I'm not talking about a way to completely eliminate scripting, just making it less worthwhile.

And made getting the colored ore 20x harder for the legit player than it was before.  It would have been far better to tie resource spots to each character, harvestable once per day.  Scripters wouldn’t be able to get all the ore before legit players got there and legit players could easily gather the ore they need.

dvvid said:

Archangel said:

dvvid said:

Archangel said:

dvvid said:

They should just make the eggs spawn in truly random locations and not fixed areas. I feel like that would help. 

how would that help you or any other normal player get more eggs, pray tell?

I’m thinking that the scripting would possibly be less effective since there wouldn’t exactly be specific areas to get the eggs. Those collecting eggs would have to run around and find them like the start of the event, before it was realized that the eggs were spawning in specific areas. I’d imagine less scripters getting them would mean more actual players would. 

Well, if you´re not one collecting eggs, please don´t suggest how it could be bettered. I collect them, and I´ve never encountered scripters. I go to where they spawn and pick 'em and it works as intended.  Heck , maybe some ppl think I'm a bot, lol,

I wouldn't even believe possible a bot or any script could react to the many variables involved with picking eggs, Should I go arround opening stable gate, oh, better to teleport through fence, around the house, oh wait one just spawned after I clicked the rune destination, rune baack, rune out again, oh, now eggs are nowhere to be seen, lets give a tour through a +1screen radius, oh found 'em, next place empty, next place only 1 instead of 2 , go to next place but remember to return in 30 seconds, many spawns dried out, been too fast, where to next, site 14 of book 1 or yea,  site 4 of book 3, bingo, oh another player emptied this area, while they finish here I'll get to next area before them, time to circle all new haven island...

and so on and so forth.. and it works.. much to others chagrin and envy, I still can fill a bag in about 25 minutes.. and after an hour and 2 full bags I leave, so others can have their go (and cuz by then I'm dizzy and half zombied out)

no bloody script could ever account for so many unforeseeable variables! 

so please, don't give solutions you don't seem to need unless you are also picking eggs.

I was collecting eggs before the last dungeon fix on ATL.  I now go in there because it is more fun.  

I'm amazed you haven't seen scripting.  Maybe you didn't realize, is also possible.  But do you really think everyone mentioning it is making stuff up?  

You would be impressed, as I was, what the scripts can do.  I've read on here and seen what people have said in Discord and finally decided to see for myself.  I went to the Yew sheep area on ATL and stood in the middle of the sheep.  No eggs, but the same people kept recalling in and out.  Nothing suspicious about that on the surface, so I was not convinced.

After waiting for an egg to spawn, which none did, I decided to test it myself.  I got an egg from my bank and went back to the spot.  Waited there for a minute or 2....saw the same people recalling in and out.  I then placed the egg next to me on the ground.  One of the characters recalled in and immediately started running to the egg, opening the stable doors no problem.  I picked up the egg as they were running and they ran to the exact spot where it was, stopped, then recalled out.

I put the egg back on the ground, another person recalled in, and started running to the egg immediately once again.  I picked up the egg and this character actually stopped the moment I picked the egg up.

Not entirely convinced this was scripted, I stuck around and did this several more times, moving to different areas, and the same exact thing happened with both of these 2 characters.  One would run all the way to the spot, even though it was obvious the egg was not there.  The other one stopping the exact moment I picked it up.  Neither of them said anything to me.  You'd think they would have something to say to me after I did this about 6 times to both of them.  I perceived this as 2 different scripts, one was better than the other.  It isn't 100% definitive proof, but seeing that in action was absolutely suspicious.

I recorded a video of some of this, but I don't even know if I care enough to do anything with the video.  I did report them though because of their actions being highly suspicious of unattended scripting. 

Anyway, my idea of randomizing the spots was merely and idea, not a stated solution.  I don't claim to know how to fix UO's problems.  I don't know why you seem to take personal offense.  Its just a thought.  I'm glad you haven't been affected negatively by the scripting.

It sounds creepy AF!
But alas I must believe you because I have seen some fishy things too, not while picking eggs per se, but related.
Once I saw an egg on the other side of the screen and someone recalled almost next to me... before I could run 2 steps the other toon managed to blitz through the whole screen and pick the egg and recall out in the blink of an eye! Un-·%"·ing believable! That speed hack/script I have seen, and I thought it must be one of those PK'rs that cheat their way in pvp around yew gate. 

Another one was yesterday, as I was turning in eggs to get my 12 ingots (now automated by the new EC macro, so I was making the ping about every 10 seconds), a toon appeared and made 12 ping sounds non stop! about a ping every second! I had to just say WTF!?, and the toon recalled away.

So yeah, some people are using cheats. But I couldn't fathom how would anyone program to find the eggs and sadly, it still baffles the mind! 

@dvvid I did a similar test.  I put an egg from my pack in the middle of group of hay stacks. The bot ran up and recalled away a few times. One player stopped, moved a hay stack and retrieved the egg.

Regarding the post about the player that left the egg in the house.  Carl Shift allows me too see everything in the house and where it is.  I can open the door and be on the egg very quickly.  Occasionally another player beats me to it but not often.
Sometimes though after I go to a known outdoor egg location, pick up the eggs and don’t leave right away, I will see a toon recall in ride very fast around the area aimlessly a couple of times and then recall out.  If an egg does appear while this is going on, the toon does not appear to see it as it continues to ride around and I grab the egg.   When there is no egg, real players tend to keep on riding or recall out.  They can see the egg is gone.

Merus said:

dvvid said:

Lord_Frodo said:

dvvid said:

Archangel said:

dvvid said:

They should just make the eggs spawn in truly random locations and not fixed areas. I feel like that would help. 

how would that help you or any other normal player get more eggs, pray tell?

I’m thinking that the scripting would possibly be less effective since there wouldn’t exactly be specific areas to get the eggs. Those collecting eggs would have to run around and find them like the start of the event, before it was realized that the eggs were spawning in specific areas. I’d imagine less scripters getting them would mean more actual players would. 

LOL  That worked so well for mining and wood gathering.

Randomizing the ore and wood didn't kill scripting, but it made scripting less efficient, wouldn't you say?  I'm not talking about a way to completely eliminate scripting, just making it less worthwhile.

And made getting the colored ore 20x harder for the legit player than it was before.  It would have been far better to tie resource spots to each character, harvestable once per day.  Scripters wouldn’t be able to get all the ore before legit players got there and legit players could easily gather the ore they need.

That’s a really good idea. 

dvvid said:

Randomizing the ore and wood didn't kill scripting, but it made scripting less efficient, wouldn't you say?  I'm not talking about a way to completely eliminate scripting, just making it less worthwhile.

How did randomizing of resources made scriting less efficient if I may ask ?

An AFK scripter, is not using his/her time at the keyboard like a player who does not use scripts.... they just fire up their client and script and then go do something else....

Better scripts, ring a loudy warning when a Game Master steps in and talks to the character so that either the player can respond and pretend that they are playing attended or, I hear, some scripts are even smart enough to answer the GM without the player needing to actually get to the keyboard...

Bottom line is, the randomizing of resources, to my understanding, just made it took longer to gather resources but, for an AFK scripter who is not actually spending time at the keyboard, this is a non issue..... they only gather more resources throughout their 24/7, 365 AFP scripting.....

It DID hurt enormousily players who do not script and ARE at the keyboard, though, who now need a LOT MORE of their time spent in the game to gather whatever resources they may need....

The core of the issue revolving around scripting is PEOPLE'S TIME.

As long as the Design of the game will make it unreasonably time intensive to get stuff in the game, scripting and AFK scripting will have all good reasons to exist.

We want to see scripting gone from Ultima Online ?

Then, the Developers need to change their Design of the game and make items, high end items well included, be way more readily available in the game, taking a whole lot less time then they do now, to be obtained in the game.

THEN, we will see scripting and AFK scripting really be gone, because becoming pointless....

@Kyronix ?

Why would you decide if the toon is run by a script based on whether they talk to u. I don't waste time writing when I someone picking up an egg before I reach it.

All the proof I needed to prove there was scripting was when the Devs changed the spawn to what it is now from "the pile". There were a bunch of gargs on ATL with crappy armor and soul glaives all piled up (and sometimes all dead in the dungeon for hours in the same spot) before the change and after the change I haven't seen a single one (they are likely scripting eggs instead). I guess all those toons just got all the drops they needed as a coincidence to when they made the change?

Yup, it's easier to catch them in static mode and check if they are afk. 

If I am rushing around and someone chat with me I don't care even it's a GM. Don't waste my time because I am trying to beat the other guy. 

Recall is ALWAYS to same location because we use rune book.

Then we ALWAYS run towards the egg if there is one. How can anyone program to run to a location if there is no egg there?

How on earth u catch a script user? 

The early Dev already knew the answer is to make a new client software which the aging community rejected for years and in the end they gave up.

This is why the current Dev team can't solve the problem. A true legacy problem, a 24 year old, well-hacked software.

No wonder we are getting a New Legacy Shard, to pair with the Classic 24 year old legacy software. 

Keep complaining about scripters and read above.