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Destard slaughterfest WOW

Started by ForeverFun · 2022-04-27 · 54 posts · General Discussions
#0
@Kyronix

Hats off, the new event is in many ways the best of its kind so far.  It has taken a bit of grind out of these events, and whole guilds are loving it.

A couple of notes:
  1. Atlantic would provide you some live debugging data to help diagnose the type of lag that is prevalent at many shard EM events.  Reducing un-needed animations, removing locks on the server side (?), etc, could all be possible tweaks to improve the experience.
  2. It's puzzling that EJ accounts get drops.  Perhaps this is a bait and switch, lure them in with this excitement, and pull the switch off later this week?

For those hunting groups, you want your party setup like this:

#1
Yup Players should accept party invites from Bards.
#2
We should go on strike until we get equipable instruments no more buffs
#3
@ForeverFun - careful tagging the Devs or the #tagpolice will make a mean post about you tagging them 

 B) 
#4
McDougle said:
We should go on strike until we get equipable instruments no more buffs
Where would I hold a bow?  You really have a bard that uses no weapon or book?
#5
This is what the event has become, on Atlantic...

#6
I dont use EC, what are the blue and fire spells?
#7
Pawain said:
I dont use EC, what are the blue and fire spells?

Wildfire on the left, Fire & Poison Field on the right.  The blue spell...I think that's one of the Mysticism Mastery abilities.  Nether Blast, maybe?
#8
ok they look similar, but nether blast is so slow and hard to hit moving targets. Thanks
#9
Those blue/purplish swirling things are EVs.
#10
It looks exactly like on Origin... minus thewildfires & EVs, lol
#11
@ForeverFun - It might just be because it's EC and it looks different to me but those pics actually look like it lightened up some because when I went down there around 9pm it seemed even worse. You can also go head down to level 3 because it's also the same exact thing down there. 

This event after the first day (ie after they made their changes) has been terrible. It's not fun at all because there just isn't enough spawn to kill on ATL regardless of the time of day. 

@Kyronix - PLEASE open up Fel side so those that want to can go there for drops. This should also help reduce the lag in Tram for those that do not want to go to Fel.
#12
keven2002 said:
@ ForeverFun - It might just be because it's EC and it looks different to me but those pics actually look like it lightened up some because when I went down there around 9pm it seemed even worse. You can also go head down to level 3 because it's also the same exact thing down there. 

This event after the first day (ie after they made their changes) has been terrible. It's not fun at all because there just isn't enough spawn to kill on ATL regardless of the time of day. 

@ Kyronix - PLEASE open up Fel side so those that want to can go there for drops. This should also help reduce the lag in Tram for those that do not want to go to Fel.
This event is... too much drop for those staying at a fixed location, and not enough drop for those who care to run around. 

If they are not going to improve this, we might as well all do the same and join the pile. 
#13
Seth said:
keven2002 said:
@ ForeverFun - It might just be because it's EC and it looks different to me but those pics actually look like it lightened up some because when I went down there around 9pm it seemed even worse. You can also go head down to level 3 because it's also the same exact thing down there. 

This event after the first day (ie after they made their changes) has been terrible. It's not fun at all because there just isn't enough spawn to kill on ATL regardless of the time of day. 

@ Kyronix - PLEASE open up Fel side so those that want to can go there for drops. This should also help reduce the lag in Tram for those that do not want to go to Fel.
This event is... too much drop for those staying at a fixed location, and not enough drop for those who care to run around. 

If they are not going to improve this, we might as well all do the same and join the pile. 

I joined the pile earlier today with my thrower... it's almost impossible to get kills (for me at least). Maybe it's because I'm on CC? I created a "target hostile" macro as I've read others have done and basically I need to hold this key down in order to even have a chance at targeting, but even then I won't always throw (and sprinkle in misses), plus sometimes I'm targeting a summon so I miss the actual spawn. It's to the point where I'm getting maybe 2 kills a minute?

I spent 45min in the pile and netted 1 drop because I'm sure my macro probably isn't setup correctly (I won't go into how stupid it is that I need a macro to actually attack something). There are like 15 toons parked on the same tile all trying to AI something that has like 200hp; only a few toons will actually get a hit. Add to that there is literally only 1 monster spawning once per 2-3 seconds in this area. I wish I could post a quick video here because it's crazy how instantly things are dying on ATL.

I can't understand why the DEVs won't open up Fel to "add spawn". At this rate, it would be better for us to just stop playing for a month and let all the scripters flood the market with drops.
#14
I am using EC and it's the same. At Atlantic the targets are killed instantly. 

The only way I feel is to have penalty to stay at one location, like To Tokuno. I am not sure if dispersing players to fel may help.
#15
Glad I don’t play on Atlantic my eyes could not take that much action in such a small space.  Honestly, can you see what you are doing or do you just rely on automatically targeting.  As a mage seems like you would not kill much using direct damage spells because in the time it takes to cast one your target would likely be killed by someone else using a weapon or pet.  Not trying to be negative just making a comparison to the lower population shard I play on.  Agree mostly spellweavers casting wildfire and mages casting EVs.  Would expect lots of eathquake, wither and other area spells being cast as well.  Also poison and fire fields like the ones on the right.
On my shard space is about the right size for the number of players we have but agree on Atlantic the larger area in the middle of the dungeon might have been better due to the much larger number of players.  If the program could handle that.
#16
Seth said:
 I am not sure if dispersing players to fel may help.
I think it would on ATL because the amount of foot traffic it gets regardless of the event is pretty decent. If there was a pile of AFK bots somewhere, I think the PK community would take care of it pretty quick regardless if all their drops were insured. I'd probably do it myself just out of principle.
#17
Arnold7 said:
Glad I don’t play on Atlantic my eyes could not take that much action in such a small space.  Honestly, can you see what you are doing or do you just rely on automatically targeting.  As a mage seems like you would not kill much using direct damage spells because in the time it takes to cast one your target would likely be killed by someone else using a weapon or pet.  Not trying to be negative just making a comparison to the lower population shard I play on.  Agree mostly spellweavers casting wildfire and mages casting EVs.  Would expect lots of eathquake, wither and other area spells being cast as well.  Also poison and fire fields like the ones on the left.
Archers are faster than mages, which i believe are responsible for the fast killing besides the aoe spells. 
#18
Each day I grow more aggravated about this event. I can’t stand the stationary brain dead piles going on.  I could my tolerate it, though, if it didn’t lag the ENTIRE DUNGEON.   The negative effects of what is going on on ATL is unavoidable. Such a disappointing event. 
#19
 “Dear trammel turkeys,
congratulations on your victorious vote for Christmas”
#20
Agreed.

Event has been live for a week and it's still not open in Fel which is a huge detriment for anyone on ATL but @Kyronix won't comment on if we will get Fel or not (and why not if we won't).

Again, anyone that logs in to ATL can 1) see the lag 2) see the pile up 3) see the insta kills. Combine that with the overwhelming amount of negative feedback on drop rate still being given and it seems like a pretty obvious issue.

At the very least humor me and say it's working as intended so I know you have no intention of fixing the event and at that point I can stop logging in for a month to allow the scripters to flood the market so I can buy what I want from them on the cheap. 
#21
You will be waiting a long time for cheap items.
#22
Pacific a ghost town this morning with more people turning in eggs than inside fighting 
#23
Really like the egg alternative.  I do both.  When I get to the point where the mouse becomes unpredictable due to the users inability to control it anymore, I head out to collect eggs.  Don’t have to worry so much about getting killed collecting eggs.
Really, wish they had this alternative at the Hythloft event.  I play later at night and on more than one occasion there just was not any other or enough players there for me play in a dungeon filled with Para. Baldrons or what ever they were.  Would have liked an alternative way to work towards what I wanted instead of doing other things instead.
#24
keven2002 said:
Agreed.

Event has been live for a week and it's still not open in Fel which is a huge detriment for anyone on ATL but @ Kyronix won't comment on if we will get Fel or not (and why not if we won't).

Again, anyone that logs in to ATL can 1) see the lag 2) see the pile up 3) see the insta kills. Combine that with the overwhelming amount of negative feedback on drop rate still being given and it seems like a pretty obvious issue.

At the very least humor me and say it's working as intended so I know you have no intention of fixing the event and at that point I can stop logging in for a month to allow the scripters to flood the market so I can buy what I want from them on the cheap. 
Seriously, did anyone heard since Deceit that dynamic events would only reward players who moved around.

I remember after TO Tokuno, drop is supposed to happen only if we are moving. Same as the old 8x8 system that requires us to move and not stay at one location. 

Also I think one Destard is too small for Atlantic, they may need to open up another location.
#25
Seth said:

Also I think one Destard is too small for Atlantic, they may need to open up another location.
Destard would be fine if the spawn wasn't limited to 4 choke point areas filled with auto attack archers. (just speaking for Atl no other shard)

Going into this i expected the spawn area to be full. The open area to be full. More than 6 water elementals at the lake. The ancient wyrm didn't even spawn while i was there today for an hour. 

These events need to act like the guardian room in Doom where spawn is based on people in the room. 
#26
Urge said:

These events need to act like the guardian room in Doom where spawn is based on people in the room. 
Boom - nailed it.
#27
keven2002 said:
Urge said:

These events need to act like the guardian room in Doom where spawn is based on people in the room. 
Boom - nailed it.
Again, I thought dynamic spawn events are supposed to have this and also anti-static. I remember we have to run around change locations to get drops and spawn was all along based on players in the dungeon. 
#28
Seth said:
keven2002 said:
Urge said:

These events need to act like the guardian room in Doom where spawn is based on people in the room. 
Boom - nailed it.
Again, I thought dynamic spawn events are supposed to have this and also anti-static. I remember we have to run around change locations to get drops and spawn was all along based on players in the dungeon. 
I'm not 100% sure on the # of spawn being dependent on the # of players in the dungeon. I think that it makes the most sense but I feel like it's not the case given that a shard like ATL seems to always run short of spawn for these events while shards like Baja always seem overrun. 

One thing that I am 100% certain of is that the spawns have never been static so the fact that it is in Destard is definitely new. It's a real shame that the Dev team can't communicate what the problem is here. What's different about Destard that it doesn't work like every other dungeon event we've had? Why was Destard picked as the dungeon if this were the case?
#29
If I were to guess the problem with server crashes, in addition to all the lag created by concentrated players (like EM events) could have also been a function of too many copses stacking up the z axis before they could decay.  I know on Napa, with just our small population, in the pile it was hard to see characters at times from the bodies piled so high.
#30
It's just kind of belaboring the point now but it's easy to see that this event has many more issues and complaints than every other event we've had and the only real difference is that the Devs decided to make a majority of the spawn static. Two of the most obvious fixes are to make the spawn non-static (why this can't be done not sure) and/or open up Fel (why this hasn't be done on ATL is mind-boggling).
#31
keven2002 said:
It's just kind of belaboring the point now but it's easy to see that this event has many more issues and complaints than every other event we've had and the only real difference is that the Devs decided to make a majority of the spawn static. Two of the most obvious fixes are to make the spawn non-static (why this can't be done not sure) and/or open up Fel (why this hasn't be done on ATL is mind-boggling).
Another solution is to change the location of the dynamic spawn since we assumed Destard has a unique problem which Ice, Fire, Deceit, Hythloth do not have.

They can always return to Destard in future events after fixing the issue.

There are so many places besides Classic dungeons.
#32
I wish the spawn points randomized their location every 10 minutes or something.


#33
How many drops can you get there per hour by spamming EQ?
#34
Pawain said:
How many drops can you get there per hour by spamming EQ?
Estimated 3 to 5, depends on the crowd and how fast they take down each. Good thing is just need to stand at one location, jam the keyboard and macro away.

When you can't beat em, we join them.

Maybe its time to read up Dummies for scripts and multi-client, and sign up another 10 EJ accounts. It's a competition on who kills faster, pings, scripts etc.
#35
Put in a code where if you don't move about 10 tiles after 15 min you don't get any drops .. But I'm sure they would make a script to move too.
#36
Pawain said:
How many drops can you get there per hour by spamming EQ?
I wasn't having much luck with that. EQ takes longer to cast than Thunderstorm.You also eventually run out of mana because even if yu are in wraith form and do manage to get a hit; it's not enough damage to really leech much mana. I did this for a little over an hour and only got 1 drop (I was out of mana for half the time).

So basically you are playing a guessing game of when to cast it and 9 outta 10 times the monster dies before you do any damage (again talking about ATL) anyway. 

Seth said:

Maybe its time to read up Dummies for scripts and multi-client, and sign up another 10 EJ accounts. It's a competition on who kills faster, pings, scripts etc.
It's sad that I've also had this thought... basically trying to figure out how to create the best macro to sit there stationary and just run this macro. This event isn't very fun for me at all. It's the first treasures of event where I'm actually looking for other things to do besides the event because I think the event is that broken. You know it's bad when I'm posting more than I play due to how jacked up it is on ATL.
#37
keven2002 said:
Pawain said:
How many drops can you get there per hour by spamming EQ?
I wasn't having much luck with that. EQ takes longer to cast than Thunderstorm.You also eventually run out of mana because even if yu are in wraith form and do manage to get a hit; it's not enough damage to really leech much mana. I did this for a little over an hour and only got 1 drop (I was out of mana for half the time).

So basically you are playing a guessing game of when to cast it and 9 outta 10 times the monster dies before you do any damage (again talking about ATL) anyway. 

Seth said:

Maybe its time to read up Dummies for scripts and multi-client, and sign up another 10 EJ accounts. It's a competition on who kills faster, pings, scripts etc.
It's sad that I've also had this thought... basically trying to figure out how to create the best macro to sit there stationary and just run this macro. This event isn't very fun for me at all. It's the first treasures of event where I'm actually looking for other things to do besides the event because I think the event is that broken. You know it's bad when I'm posting more than I play due to how jacked up it is on ATL.
I'm not on Atlantic. What are the static players doing?  Are they doing something to get more than 5 drops an hour or it don't matter cause they there for the long haul.
#38
What you see on some shards is a pack of 5 warriors all basically in lock step, similarly geared up, moving around rapidly, cross-healing with bandages, including extremely fast resurrection of the occasional death in the "squad".  This seems more prevalent in off prime time hours.

Server side movement detection is likely not reliable in cases like this.

#39
So players with multiple accounts that are not cheating because they are attended because they are able to res the dead.

Thank you for the detailed description without speculation and conspiracy theories.

We play on computers, it is surprising that posters do not realize what a computer can do.

I can see the frustration building because this kind of thing could go on in the previous dungeons but the mobs were so spread out they did not interfere with others getting their own drops.

Instead of reckless speculation and making up solutions that hurt legit players, (the cheaters will cheat anyway, and limiting game play techniques only hurts legit players).

Concentrate on ways to make the dungeon fun like it was on the first 2 nights!


#40
Pawain said:
I'm not on Atlantic. What are the static players doing?  Are they doing something to get more than 5 drops an hour or it don't matter cause they there for the long haul.
Static players are literally in a stack standing there auto armor ignore a monster .01 seconds after it spawns. It's to the point where a paragon shadow wyrm dies within 10 seconds.

I play CC so I created a macro for select nearest hostile / attack target and due to the fact there are 2 actions in the macro (ie takes maybe .5 seconds to actually target) I do not fire quick enough to damage 90% of the targets. 

I do not know how many drops they get per toon but multiply that number by however many accounts they use. Then of course apply that to likely 10-15-20 hours a day since they have an endless loop running. 

#41
This event is not fun at all, they should just stop and reconfigure elsewhere, even Deceit or Hythloth are fine I suppose...
#42
Seth said:
This event is not fun at all
No it's not. Destard seems like it gave me more drops but I actually felt like I was participating in Hythloth by helping clear rooms and with paragons.

This event is nothing more than a beat the clock before mobs die. 
#43
Have to say I'm sorry I missed the first few days as I can't make a comparison to it but from what I have heard the drop numbers were pretty high. Now that I finally have a chance to take part in this event, I've found with a potion of fortune running I'm lucky to get 12 to 15 drops in an hour. This coupled with the higher cost of things like the spell books means it will take 20 to 23 hours of game time with potions running in order to get one. Not to mention other items which are nice to have. I really think this is well over the top of what would be considered fair exchange for time. In short I think that the drop rate currently is far too low for this event. 

The other thing I find hard to believe is that EJ accounts are able to collect drops for this event. Why should people be allowed to automate multiple accounts which have no downside as one can be remade if - and that a huge if -- one gets banned. Hell, no reason not to script this or anything else as it appears there are no consequences. 
#44
Ah the EJ yes, here's what most people didn't know:

Day1-2: EJ were able to get drops.
D3: EJ no longer get drops.
D3.5: Dev fixed the spawn location BUT somehow let in the bad codes, so EJ were getting drops AGAIN

Quality Level of this dev team's work is SO BAD. At this point, the playerbase should not put anymore cash into this game. UO is still great. This dev is NOT.
#45
To add into drop info...

I actually logged into Pacific and played for a couple hours yesterday and today.

At the "pile", both yesterday afternoon and this afternoon, a group of about 5 or 6 people got stuff rolling and I just stood there and cast Thunderstorm. I was averaging about 4-5 drops per cast of Gift of Life, so about 16-20 drops per hour, no potions. If I stood just west of the pile toward the stairs down to level 2, I could hit the north and south edges of the stairs with Wildfire, pulling all those mobs toward me, and the thrower/archers. I think there was 1 thrower and 2 archers, plus 2-3 actual fighters running around. Anyway, no-one was casting summons and the lag wasn't too bad, so that was an ok setup.

However, I also spent about an hour each day running around on the same mage, but not at the pile. Average drops were around maybe 3 an hour...that's not very satisfying. Mage was mid to mid/high end and Mages always have problems with paragons so it is what it is...
I think one of the big problems with the Mage is having to Invis to break aggro. I'm betting that completely messes with your drop rate.

Tried two cross healers in the same locations as the mage (sticking to the east wall of the main room and into the north area) and got about 4-5 drops per hour per toon, so 8-10 per hour total. The x-healers were not geared, but at least could take down the paragons without having to run.


Pawain posted in another thread that one of the things about Destard that's different is the lack of little stuff to kill. I think that is spot on. In Deceit there were gobs of zombies, skeletons, wraiths, etc. Even paragon versions were manageable. Destard seems to start tough and go up from there. I thought they might be adding Fey to give lower level characters something to kill, but uh, no. Why don't you suck on a couple Paragon Lattice Seekers there mid level mage.


FYI, the entire north area, if you drag any dragons/greaters back to the main room, will only spawn drakes, wyverns, water eles, and the Fey/Shadow Wyrm. The Fey and Shadow Wyrm spawn seem to be linked, so you get Shadow Wyrms in all the Fey locations (Possibly C/P drakes as well - C/P may be the alternate days mob for this event).

Anyway, if you rid the North area of dragons/greaters, it's not a bad place for mid level characters to fight (not mid level mages). You can ignore the drakes/wyverns and just concentrate on the Fey. I zoomed the screen way out and like the other Fey spawns, as soon as you kill one another spawns. I've seen them spawn anywhere in that north room now, from the shrine to the water pool in the SE. Makes it harder to find them, but you don't get over-run and a good mage or tamer can solo a paragon without having people dragging to you all the time.

-Good luck.
#46
@Arroth_Thaiel

re.
At the "pile", both yesterday afternoon and this afternoon, a group of about 5 or 6 people got stuff rolling and I just stood there and cast Thunderstorm. I was averaging about 4-5 drops per cast of Gift of Life, so about 16-20 drops per hour, no potions.

I assumed you mean Thunderstorm in the last paragraph?

Do u use wraith form or bard mastery to support the mana required?
#47
Radst said:
Ah the EJ yes, here's what most people didn't know:

Day1-2: EJ were able to get drops.
D3: EJ no longer get drops.
D3.5: Dev fixed the spawn location BUT somehow let in the bad codes, so EJ were getting drops AGAIN

Quality Level of this dev team's work is SO BAD. At this point, the playerbase should not put anymore cash into this game. UO is still great. This dev is NOT.
There inability to get minor events right shows how much of a crap shoot we are in for with the release of New Legacy.
#48
Seth said:
@ Arroth_Thaiel

re.
At the "pile", both yesterday afternoon and this afternoon, a group of about 5 or 6 people got stuff rolling and I just stood there and cast Thunderstorm. I was averaging about 4-5 drops per cast of Gift of Life, so about 16-20 drops per hour, no potions.

I assumed you mean Thunderstorm in the last paragraph?

Do u use wraith form or bard mastery to support the mana required?
Sorry for the confusion Seth.

I would cast Gift of Life and use it as a timer. Gift of Life last's about 16 min.

During the time GoL was running, I would just stand there casting Thunderstorm. When GoL expired, I could see how many drops I'd received in the last ~15min.

So, I did this for about an hour each evening and got around 20 drops each evening, so about 40 drops total over 2 hours spread across two days.



I didn't use Wraith Form or Bard mastery. It was just my mage toon by himself (for these two examples - I did try other setup's - but that was all a big hassle). He's mid-level ish...6x120 with med, focus, magery, eval, weaving, resist, but not really any gear. SDI is about 80 and he's not even wearing a cloak!

I spent a lot of time in active meditation (Wraith Form might be a large bonus here...) and learned to time my Thunderstorm's to when there were multiple critters around. Casting when there's only 1 centaur or something is worthless. Even shadow wyrms die fast to the archers. 

That's part of the reason I stood a few tiles west of the main pile, just at the edge of the archers range. I could cast Wildfire out much further, hit a bunch of stuff and pull it towards the pile, get off a Thunderstorm or two as it approached, and then the archers would destroy it on the tile in front of me. I was basically using the archers like a cannon perimeter. I stood within the archer shield and lured enemies into the zone of death.

Again, this is all on Pacific, not sure how any of this would behave on Atlantic.
#49

Again, this is all on Pacific, not sure how any of this would behave on Atlantic.
I can give you an idea... even in wraith form with a shadow wisp you would run out of mana and spend more time trying to med than casting. Things are being killed so quick in the "pile" that it's literally only spawning 1 monster per second or two which is quickly killed by any archer/thrower in range. If you were to cast T-Storm the exact second you saw something spawn; it would be dead before the spell hits even with 4/8 casting. If you are lucky you might damage 1 monster every 5-10min.

This event might be fine or even tolerable on other less populated shards but on ATL it's an absolute grind for maybe 4 drops an hour in the pile. Outside of the pile is a bit better but not much; I've barely been able to crack double digit drops at like 6am... during prime time forget about it.
#50
Arroth_Thaiel said:

Again, this is all on Pacific, not sure how any of this would behave on Atlantic.
It wouldn't. I do wraith form thunderstorm and most mobs are AI to death on Atl before i can get thunderstorm off. lol? If i'm lucky i have time to get one off on a paragon shadow wyrm. 

I'll fussed enough about this on Atl. If you're enjoying it then that's awesome. 
#51
@Rorschach - Let's also close and lock this thread that has 10x the amount of "toxicity" than my thread asking about the fixes.
#52
"this one time in destard, i got looting rights on a wisp, don't ask me how it happened"
#53
keven2002 said:
@ Rorschach - Let's also close and lock this thread that has 10x the amount of "toxicity" than my thread asking about the fixes.
You really seem to like telling people to close threads here. Let them moderate as they see fit. 
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